[OSM-talk] Creation of "Data Items" by bot for undocumented tags

[Yuri Astrakhan]

It is very strange that we, on one hand, allow anyone to create any kind of
tags (just type it in), and on the other we create so many hurdles to
document it (we refuse to allow a wiki page about an item, but instead
demand that each key page go through a proposals process, approve it,
etc).  I believe this is a ridiculous situation solvable with the data
items.  If I, the editor, create a new tag, I should have a way to type in
a short textual description (one/two sentences) explaining what that tag
is.  Without knowing how to create wiki pages or data item pages or using
the right templates, or even knowing which fields to fill out where. Data
items allow for that.

When a data item is created automatically, it makes the process of adding
such documentation very straightforward -- e.g. if one uses iD editor, they
simply expand the (i) button next to the tag, click edit, and type in the
description.

Moreover, it should be possible to do so directly from iD, without going to
another page. The eventual goal is to make it simple to add such
descriptions __without__ leaving the current editing tool (iD/JOSM/...) and
without visiting the wiki.  These tools will be able to view other metadata
as well -- e.g. if this tag should be usable on a way/node in a consistent
way, regardless of the language of the user.

On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 5:54 PM Andrew Hain <andrewhainosm at hotmail.co.uk>
wrote:

> I strongly disagree.
>
> It is perfectly useful to document the existence of tags in the database
> with data items. For example one was created for the key sub_sea:type [
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Item:Q4506] and it has been possible
> to add this it is a discardable tag that the main OSM editors remove when
> editing. While it is possible in principle to add a long form tag
> documentation page, and indeed the presence of the data item is a record
> that one may be worth writing, it needs a different set of skills to
> research its content. As such the data item and others like it are useful
> on their own.
>
> --
> Andrew
> ------------------------------
> *From:* Joseph Eisenberg <joseph.eisenberg at gmail.com>
> *Sent:* 18 February 2020 17:28
> *To:* osm <talk at openstreetmap.org>
> *Subject:* [OSM-talk] Creation of "Data Items" by bot for undocumented
> tags
>
> Data Items should not be created by bot for undocumented tags.
>
> According to
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Data_items#Item_Creation_Process
> the Data Items (aka "Wikibase" or "Wiki Data items") are automatically
> created by a bot, even before a tag is documented, if a tag has a
> certain standard format and more than 10 uses in the database.
>
> The data item is created in this case with the text "‎Created a new
> Item: Auto-updating from Wiki pages" - e.g.
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Item:Q19947&action=history
>
> This is confusing to users. For example, Item:Q19947 above,
> "landuse=research" was created before there was a wiki page. Then
> yesterday a user documented the tag with a page, but did not
> understand why there was already a data item:
>
> "Wikibase entry: evidence for preceding deletion? I've just created
> landuse=research, but the data item
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Item:Q19947&action=history
> was already existing in December '19. How was the data item then
> created?"
>
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Wiki=#Wikibase_entry:_evidence_for_preceding_deletion.3F
>
> Besided the potential confusion caused by creating these items by
> bots, I think it is a bad idea to encourage wiki users to start
> editing these data items without first creating an actual
> human-readable wiki page to document the tag.
>
> In theory, the "Data Items" can be useful if they properly document
> how tags are used, in a way that is easier for computers to handle,
> but this only works if the data is maintained and updated.
>
> Creating a new wiki page (by human) will alert other users via
> "Special:Recent" and "Special:NewPages", while the stream of items
> created by bots is too much for humans to maintain, and the page names
> are too obscure (Item: Q19947 is meaningless) to be scanned by humans.
>
> Therefore, I propose that Yurikbot be changed to only add new data
> items for documented tags which already have a wiki page in at least
> one language. I do not see a benefit to creating date items for
> undocumented tags.
>
> Joseph Eisenberg
>
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