[OSM-talk] Fwd: Fix maritime borders of Ceuta and Melilla (Spain)
Mateusz Konieczny
matkoniecz at tutanota.com
Sun Feb 21 07:38:35 UTC 2021
The standard way of obtaining waiver is for mapper interested in using this data is to obtain it.
LWG is in general not the entity involved in getting required waivers, it is rather done by
whoever is interested in making the import.
Feb 20, 2021, 17:12 by bert.araali.afritastic at gmail.com:
>
> I come to the same conclusion Colin, there is a need and advise from the LWG to ask for a waiver.
>
>
> Taking a more detailed look at their data, it might be a valuable resource to consider it, being allowed to use their data also to verify and improve other maritime borders.
> Can I hope Andy to take the initiative with the DWG for the waiver if they consider this is a valuable data source ?
>
> Greetings,
>
>
> Bert Araali
>
> On 20/02/2021 18:49, Colin Smale wrote:
>
>> Looks like their data is licensed as CC-BY 4.0 which is very permissive but I can't say if it is enough for inclusion in OSM.
>> https://marineregions.org/disclaimer.php
>>
>> It actually looks like it may be possible, with some additional documentation:
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Import/ODbL_Compatibility
>> https://blog.openstreetmap.org/2017/03/17/use-of-cc-by-data/
>>
>> They also have ready-made median lines available for download, licensed as above.
>>
>>> On 02/20/2021 2:54 PM Bert -Araali- Van Opstal >>> <bert.araali.afritastic at gmail.com> <mailto:bert.araali.afritastic at gmail.com>>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Can this be a possible source (although also simplified vector lines):
>>> >>> https://www.marineregions.org/about.php
>>>
>>>
>>> They provide downloadable shape, KML and low resolution data files. Someone could ask them to provide us with high resolution data as they seemed to have done all the calculations according to the UN regulations and International Standards. They used PostGIS to produce it.
>>> >>> https://www.marineregions.org/downloads.php
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Didn't look at any License restrictions or conflicts though.
>>>
>>>
>>> Greetings,
>>>
>>>
>>> Bert Araali
>>>
>>> On 20/02/2021 16:32, Colin Smale wrote:
>>>
>>>> The Median Lines are defined in terms of the Baselines - a simplified representation of the coastline doing specific things around islands, bays and estuaries. Perhaps we can get hold of the Baseline data and create our own median lines mathematically from that?
>>>>
>>>>> On 02/20/2021 2:13 PM Bert -Araali- Van Opstal >>>>> <bert.araali.afritastic at gmail.com> <mailto:bert.araali.afritastic at gmail.com>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Dear Andy, list members,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Do you have or are there resources which we can use to define these Median Lines and which cause no licensing conflicts ?
>>>>> Do you have the intention to create a wiki page to describe this issue and how you plan to implement it ?
>>>>>
>>>>> If you need some help, I am very willing to allocate some time to participate. As I have mapped 325 (mostly administrative) boundaries already in JOSM.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Greetings,
>>>>>
>>>>> Bert Araali>>>>>
>>>>> On 20/02/2021 14:50, Andy Townsend wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 03/02/2021 10:44, Andrew Davidson wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Spanish law says that in the absence of an agreement with another country, their territorial sea shall not extend beyond the median line:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> >>>>>>> https://www.state.gov/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/LIS149-Spain.pdf>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Moroccan law also has the same arrangement:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> >>>>>>> https://www.un.org/Depts/los/LEGISLATIONANDTREATIES/PDFFILES/MAR_1973_Act.pdf>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As there is no agreement between the two countries it would appear that they both think the boundary is the median line. However Morocco amended their law last year:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> >>>>>>> https://www.moroccoembassy.co.za/morocco-in-the-news/260-morocco-updates-its-maritime-legislation-to-un-standards>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Details in English are sparse (they haven't sent the required paper work to the UN yet), but the changes appear to be about their Atlantic maritime boundaries.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks Andrew.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I was waiting here just in case anyone posted another point of view, and no-one has. Unfortunately the US document (which describes the Spanish point of view) says "The Kingdom of Spain also includes its exclaves located on the northern coast of Africa, which are beyond the scope of this study". It does, however, describe what Spain does elsewhere, which is presumably a "general intent". As you say, the Moroccan article 2 ("In the absence of a specific agreement on the subject, the breadth of the territorial waters shall not extend beyond a median line every point of which is equidistant from the nearest points on the baselines of the Moroccan or adjacent coasts") is clearer.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Does anyone see a problem with the "median line" approach?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If not, does anyone fancy volunteering to actually make the change? It'd need to be someone familiar with boundary editing, which probably means familiarity with JOSM's "validator" to check that the resulting boundaries are both valid multipolygons and match the documentation above. If not, I can do it, but it might take a bit longer.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best Regards,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Andy (from the DWG)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>> >>>>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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