[HOT] FW: Validation

john whelan jwhelan0112 at gmail.com
Sun Aug 30 00:52:52 UTC 2015


check in /out might be considered a regional dialect, you have to consider
the audience and their level of English, I think keep it as simple and as
clear as possible.

Cheerio John

On 29 August 2015 at 20:15, Denis Carriere <carriere.denis at gmail.com> wrote:

> I'm liking "check in" & "check out", I feel terminology is more commonly
> used.
>
> Also ethically the words "start work" doesn't look as good as button vs.
> "check in".
>
> My personal opinion, +1 on "check in" & "check out"
>
> *~~~~~~*
> *Denis Carriere*
> *GIS Project Manager*
>
> *Twitter: @DenisCarriere <https://twitter.com/DenisCarriere/>*
> *OSM: DenisCarriere <https://www.openstreetmap.org/user/DenisCarriere>*
> Email: Carriere.Denis at gmail.com
>
> On Sat, Aug 29, 2015 at 4:12 PM, Suzan Reed <suzan at suzanreed.com> wrote:
>
>> Would 'start work' and 'stop work' be clear to all people?
>>
>> Suzan
>> Sent from my phone. Please forgive errors.
>>
>>
>>
>> On August 29, 2015 11:46:55 AM Jarmo Kivekäs <jarmo.kivekas at guttula.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi!
>>>
>>> There has been some related discussion in a github issue[1] about this
>>> last October.
>>>
>>> I rather like the "Stop working on task" alternative that is suggested
>>> instead of the "Unlock" button in that issue. Especially since currently
>>> the button to lock a task says "Start mapping". There is more obvious
>>> connection between start/stop than start/unlock.
>>>
>>> Checking in and checking out content is probably a strange concept to
>>> many. I don't think it's an improvement over locking and unlocking.
>>>
>>> "Submit for review" is a definitive improvement over "Mark as done". It
>>> should be implemented.
>>>
>>> I've played around a little and made the changes I like the best in a
>>> local copy of the tasking manager (screenshot in attachment). I'll
>>> implement the changes and make a pull request if we come to an agreement.
>>>
>>> -- jarmo
>>>
>>> [1] https://github.com/hotosm/osm-tasking-manager2/issues/401
>>>
>>> On 29.08.2015 05:22, Jim Smith wrote:
>>>
>>>> I like the idea of renaming the 'mark as done' button to 'submit for
>>>> review'. Little tweaks like that can bring clarity to those starting out.
>>>> Also Suzan suggested that the “lock” “unlock” function be renamed to “Check
>>>> out” and “check in". That would make a big difference as well.
>>>>
>>>> I don't want to be too overenthusiastic  but is there any reason not to
>>>> make those two improvements? If no objection, can they be done soon?
>>>>
>>>> Jim
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Martin Dittus [mailto:martin at dekstop.de]
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2015 7:44 AM
>>>> To: David Toy <d at vidtoy.co.uk>
>>>> Cc: hot <hot at openstreetmap.org>
>>>> Subject: Re: [HOT] Validation
>>>>
>>>> As I’m going through the comments again (here and on my diary post) I’m
>>>> starting to realise how important it is to give feedback to newcomers.
>>>> Without it, few people will ever feel confident about their contributions.
>>>>
>>>> In many cases it probably doesn’t even need to be feedback from an
>>>> expert — it could be a comment from someone with similar experience levels.
>>>> A second pair of eyes.
>>>>
>>>> An important part of this is being able to ask someone for a second
>>>> opinion. At a mapathon that’s easy, but where do remote mappers go?
>>>>
>>>> m.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 24 Aug 2015, at 19:00, David Toy <d at vidtoy.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Jarmo. Welcome!
>>>>>
>>>>> My introduction/onboarding to HOT was almost identical to Jarmo's -
>>>>> and I can relate very clearly to all the points he has raised. I suspect
>>>>> that there are a few more lurkers on this list who will be similar.
>>>>>
>>>>> Pierre G's document suggests renaming the 'mark as done' button to
>>>>> 'submit for review'.
>>>>>
>>>>> A simplification of terms / altered workflow would have helped me
>>>>> initially. Taking the example of the done button, 'submit for review'
>>>>> implies that:
>>>>> - a) it's ok to make a mistake getting started - someone will catch
>>>>> it, and
>>>>> - b) I should expect feedback
>>>>>
>>>>> This helps with Jarmo's first and second scenarios, but also softens
>>>>> the blow when (your first) task is coldly invalidated with only four
>>>>> words of explanation. (Validators: that's not a criticism - I
>>>>> understand the time pressure.)
>>>>>
>>>>> Also, not all users will read the docs - while training resources are
>>>>> useful, these little nudges of understanding help all users - even the new
>>>>> ones who enthusiastically started but didn't read the instructions.
>>>>>
>>>>> David
>>>>>
>>>>> On 24 August 2015 at 17:18, Jarmo Kivekäs <jarmo.kivekas at guttula.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> Hi!
>>>>>
>>>>> I've been lurking on the mailing list for a while, but I'm still
>>>>> fairly new to HOT. I though I'd pitch in.
>>>>>
>>>>> I definitely recognized myself from Martin's write up as belonging to
>>>>> the set of contributors who commit changes but don't mark tiles as
>>>>> done.
>>>>> Below are some reasons why I've not marked tiles as complete in the
>>>>> past.
>>>>>
>>>>> 1. I think part of the reason is that I started out mapping on my own
>>>>> (I haven't found a local community, nor was I introduced to mapping on
>>>>> a mapathon). Therefore I haven't been able to just quickly ask someone
>>>>> advice about something I'm unsure about. In these cases I've usually
>>>>> left a comment in the tasking manager about whatever I was unsure
>>>>> about, mapped the rest, but not marked the tile as done.
>>>>>
>>>>> Not marking the tile done is me being conservative, I guess. As a new
>>>>> mapper it is currently difficult to get feedback on the quality of
>>>>> your mapping, you pretty much needs to actively seek it out. Getting
>>>>> notifications when there are new comments on tiles you've worked on
>>>>> would be nice.
>>>>>
>>>>> 2. When parts of a region are already mapped (probably form before the
>>>>> activation was created) but the tiles that are already mapped are not
>>>>> marked as done. I'm reluctant to mark a grid as done without making
>>>>> any changes to it, even if it seemingly fills all the criterion for
>>>>> the task. Especially when the grid has been locked my multiple users
>>>>> in the past. "They didn't think it was as done, I'm probably missing
>>>>> something." I realize that this thinking only propagates the problem,
>>>>> since I'll just be one more user on the list.
>>>>>
>>>>> 3. Grids can be pretty large. Sometimes you just don't manage to map
>>>>> it completely in a short sitting. I know grids can be split, but...
>>>>>
>>>>> 4. Sometimes I'll for example only be mapping roads. Doing this will
>>>>> result in many tiles being checked out and changesets are generated,
>>>>> but no tiles are actually being finished.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -- Jarmo
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 24.08.2015 16:37, Martin Dittus wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 24 Aug 2015, at 11:22, john whelan <jwhelan0112 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'd also like to see a third option on the tasking manger "I've done
>>>>>>> some work but not completed the tile could someone review it please."  I'd
>>>>>>> rather catch errors early and some new mappers may not feel confident
>>>>>>> enough to mark a tile complete.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Considering better workflows for “incomplete” submissions is well
>>>>>> worthwhile. This week I found that about half of all HOT contributors never
>>>>>> mark their first task as “done” although they contributed edits to the map.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I’ve written it up here, with stats and a brief discussion:
>>>>>> https://www.openstreetmap.org/user/dekstop/diary/35649
>>>>>>
>>>>>> m.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
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