[HOT] Tasking ManagerS (Was: {Re: Map4Haiti} + {[Hot-francophone] Project over Grand'Anse})
Rod Bera
rod at goarem.org
Mon Oct 24 12:19:08 UTC 2016
now we've got overlapping tasks.
http://taches.francophonelibre.org/project/64
http://tasks.hotosm.org/project/2252
where do we go from here?
This could/should have been anticipated/prevented.
Now we should consider trans-TM indexing, as these and other TM
instances are probably here to last.
On 24/10/16 10:07, Cristiano Giovando wrote:
> Bonjour,
>
> (s'il vous plaît excuser mon anglais)
>
> There are three WorldView 3 images available, captured on October 10
> over the Grand'Anse and Sud departments. These have limited cloud
> coverage and show very dramatically the impact of Hurricane Matthew in
> western Haiti:
>
>
https://beta.openaerialmap.org/#/-74.3994140625,18.521278249360137,10/032210312003?date=month&_k=uvs9ut
>
> We, at HOT would like to create three tasks to update all baseline
> information as shown by those images. I noticed that you guys
> currently have a task over the same area which is using Bing as
> default imagery source:
>
> http://taches.francophonelibre.org/project/64
>
> In order to coordinate our efforts, I would like you to consider this
> project that I just set up and ask you to let me know if you think it
> would make sense to publish it first, since it has that more recent
> imagery:
>
> http://tasks.hotosm.org/project/2252
>
> Right now it's published with low priority, just for you to be able to
> see it. For reference, this is the exact extent:
>
http://geojson.io/#id=gist:anonymous/5cfec955932472ebd1d23a01421a42c5&map=11/18.4698/-74.4193
>
> Please let me know what you think, also in terms of instructions.
> Happy to discuss or change anything based on everyone's feedback
> before publishing it (bumping it up to high priority).
>
> Also, we will not be doing any damage assessment (as indicated in the
> task), so if you guys have any need to do it, feel free to use the TMS
> services off of OAM. Here's one to browse the same October 10 image:
>
http://oam-dynamic-tiler-tmp.s3-website-us-east-1.amazonaws.com/57fecc6984ae75bb00ec752c/preview/#19/18.57497/-74.38157
>
> Looking forward to your feedback.
> Thank you,
>
> Cristiano
>
>
On 24/10/16 11:46, Rod Bera wrote:
> Hi Mikel,
>
>> that's a seperate topic from running an additional unnecessary
>> tasking manager.
>
> to me it's not.
> As I understand things, the fact that a task needs to be
> endorsed/supported by HOT if it is to appear on tasks.hotosm.org is a
> problem. The fact that only co-opted ("trained", "friends") individual
> can post a task is a problem too.
>
> There were discussions on this in the past with people advocating a more
> open policy for tasks.hotosm.org.
>
> This did not happen for some reasons internal to HOT US Inc.
>
> Then it appeared as a logical consequence that others would set-up
> tasking managers fit for their needs.
> Related to this is last year's discussion on default logos (TM by
> default had a HOT logo), name (HOT tasking manager formerly incorrectly
> known as OSM tasking manager). This was settled, more or less.
>
> The next logical step (I also mentioned it at that time) was what is
> happening now: possibly conflicting tasks. Well it is not the case yet:
> as as far as I can see there is no overlap between tasks from
> tasks.hotosm.org and tasks from taches.francophonelibre.org, but it will
> fatally happen at some point.
>
> To address this I proposed a number of solutions which had not much
> success:
> -indexing tasking managers and tasks into a reference catalogue, or
> -indexing TMs and tasks into catalogueS, possibly one for each TM with
> service metadata, and subsequently allow for either cross-harvesting, or
> -bottom-up harvesting if there is a truly community-operated reference
> catalogue endorsed by everyone.
>
>
> I agree this makes things a bit complicated as it would ideally require
> GeoNetwork instances (ideally one for each TM) or something similar. But
> the INSPIRE SDI experience in Europe shows it works quite smoothly.
>
> However I agree it adds-up some complexity where we could avoid it. If
> only there was only ONE TM that would be EVERYONE'S TM.
> The de facto control of the original TM by HOT with a disputable policy
> as to who had a right/privilege to define and post tasks broke up this hope.
>
> Given this I have no problem with tasks.hotosm.org being administered
> with HOT US Inc. rules. Or other TM being administered according to
> different policies. We are diverse after all.
>
> Now, we probably agree that beyond this diversity we have to work
> together as a global community.
>
> To this aim I'll be happy to collaborate with you to find ways of coming
> up with the kind of "universal catalogue of tasks" we (OSM) need.
>
> tasks.hotosm.org #2219 #2229 #2236 #2237 #2248 etc., as well as
> taches.francophonelibre.org #35 #40 # 41 #45 #63 #64 #65 #66 #67 etc.
> are all pertinent and they all should be primarily viewed as the
> contributions from the OSM community instead of the organisations
> running the tasking managers.
>
> Regards,
>
> Rod
>
>
>
>
>
> On 15/10/16 15:28, Mikel Maron wrote:
>> Agree with you John. Working with local mapper groups of course is the
>> best. There are many French speaking HOT members and volunteers,
>> including in Haiti.
>>
>> But that's a seperate topic from running an additional unnecessary
>> tasking manager.
>>
>> Mikel
>>
>> On Saturday, October 15, 2016, 9:08 AM, john whelan
>> <jwhelan0112 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Which begs the question why should HOT decide the priorities?
>>
>> I note that we don't see many projects from local groups especially
>> in the high priority list and in this case Haiti the local language
>> is French which means it is more difficult for the local needs to be
>> understood by none francophone outsiders.
>>
>> There are problems with the functioning of the government of Haiti
>> but there are functioning OSM locals but the best way to strengthen
>> them is to work with them.
>>
>> Cheerio John
>>
>> On 15 October 2016 at 08:03, Mikel Maron <mikel.maron at gmail.com
>> <javascript:return>> wrote:
>>
>> Having two tasking managers for the same response area is of
>> course going to create conflicts. There's no need at all to
>> create jobs for Haiti on another tasking manager. Simply,
>> communicate the needs for mapping, including AOI, need, etc, to
>> the HOT activation team and it will be prioritized and set up.
>>
>> Mikel
>>
>> On Saturday, October 15, 2016, 4:51 AM, Severin Menard
>> <severin.menard at gmail.com <javascript:return>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> New update about our contribution to the OSM Map4Haiti
>> mapping. Job #45
>> <http://taches.francophonelibre.org/project/45#task/61> is
>> almost done now and we will start mapping the rural areas
>> within the hills of département of Grande-Anse, over the
>> communes of Abricots, Dame-Marie, Chambellan, Moron, Anse
>> d'Hainault and Grande Anse, located in the most affected
>> areas by Hurricane Matthew (UNOSAT impact zone 1, with winds
>> over 120 km/h) with job #64
>> <http://taches.francophonelibre.org/project/64>, continuing
>> our systematic, consolidated effort over the hills (called
>> mornes in Haiti).
>>
>> We hold an agile SOTM today here at Université Alassane
>> Ouattara and will have a team of crisis mapping during the
>> whole day to show students and people what it is. No
>> newcomer will be invited to map on Haiti from Bouaké but
>> invited to become a local mapper, raise his skills and join
>> later when experienced enough.
>>
>> I hope this message is read by the HOT US coordination team,
>> especially Dale Kunce:
>>
>> October 8 6:30 PM UTC I communicated about job #39
>> <http://taches.francophonelibre.org/project/39> about
>> pre-disaster mapping over Jeremie. On October 12, when our
>> mapping is almost done on Central Jeremie, we figure out
>> people are mapping on the area, due to a HOT US job #2228
>> <http://tasks.hotosm.org/project/2228> created by Dale
>> Kunce. We stopped and quickly detected all the mistakes done
>> by very recent mappers.
>>
>> October 12 11:40 AM UTC I communicated on the hot list
>> including regarding job #45
>> <http://taches.francophonelibre.org/project/45> about
>> mapping Jeremie’s hinterland. Later this day, HOT US job
>> #2224 <http://tasks.hotosm.org/project/2224> covering an
>> area slightly smaller inside the one I made was created by
>> Dale Kunce... As if there was no other places to be mapped
>> in Haiti...
>>
>>
>> So far, we created 7 jobs over Haiti, I communicated about
>> them and they are all on the
>> <http://taches.francophonelibre.org>http://taches.
>> francophonelibre.org frontpage, so it is not a big deal just
>> to check them.
>>
>> @Dale I think HOT US created a curriculum to raise skills to
>> become Crisis activators, I would advise you to read it one
>> day when you have a bit of time. If ever it does not mention
>> to read and communicate in the hot list during an
>> activation, I would suggest to add it into the
>> documentation. As an incorporated company, HOT US may have
>> its own internal tools to organize its mapping, but the
>> minimum is to communicate a bit on the hot list with the OSM
>> community, who is the holder of this list (as everything
>> with @openstreetmap.org <http://openstreetmap.org>).
>>
>> If you now create a new job covering job #45
>> <http://taches.francophonelibre.org/project/45#task/61>, I
>> may try next time to create a job in the middle of the
>> water, just to see if you jump on it.
>>
>> Sincerely,
>>
>> Severin
>>
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>>
>>
>>
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>
>
--
Rod Béra, MCF Géomatique / Lecturer, Geomatics
et SIG pour l'Environnement / and Environmental GIS
Agrocampus-Ouest|65 r.Saint-Brieuc|CS84215|35042 Rennes cedex|France
+33 (0) 223 48 5553 - roderic.bera at agrocampus-ouest.fr
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