[Osmf-talk] do-ocracy and volunteering

Rory McCann rory.mccann at osmfoundation.org
Fri Apr 17 15:15:47 UTC 2020

I'm not 100% sure what you're saying. Since you often have good 
insights, I frequently need to digest what you say. I'm sorry if my 
email appears condesending.

It's useful to point out flaws with suggestions. But, personally, I find 
it better when there's a positive counter proposal for what to do 
instead. β€œDon't do this” is fine, but then what am I supposed to do? 
Just not do any video chat? Stay with Mumble?

If you (or anyone!) did host (or propose) an alternative, then there are 
multiple competing options for how to do video chat. Please god feel 
free to suggest something! I'm being genuine & serious. Just f**king do 
it. Until then, from a practical point of view, the options are (i) 
audio with Mumble (ii) This BBB server (iii) Zoom (iv) Google Hangouts 

On 17/04/2020 12:28, Christoph Hormann wrote:
> On Thursday 16 April 2020, Rory McCann wrote:
>> OSM is a do-ocracy. πŸ˜‰ FOSSGIS (or others) hasn't set up or arranged
>> an alternative. We have one option. Ergo that options wins. πŸ˜‰πŸ˜‰
> I am sorry for drifting a bit off-topic in this thread - but the above
> indicates potentially a rather problematic mixing of two things that do
> not mix well.  I am not sure if this is meant ironically - but to make
> sure, even if it is, that it is not widely read and taken at face
> value - the following comment.
> OSM can in the long term only work as a do-ocracy as far as volunteer
> work of individual independent volunteers is concerned.  Mixing in
> organized and especially corporate activity into the do-ocratic domain
> would destabilize the whole thing.  A company like Google could
> essentially take over the project by donating sufficient manpower and
> resources if do-ocratic principles are interpreted to apply to
> organized and corporate activities as well.
> People are much less likely to volunteer their personal time and
> resources if they see these being just used and purely valued as a
> cheap substitute for commercial services.  Saying:  "We take whatever
> option is offered to us according to 'Einem geschenkten Gaul schaut man
> nicht ins Maul' and - should that fail at some point we will take money
> to buy a substitute" is much less likely to motivate volunteers than
> saying "We use this commercial service for testing now but in the long
> term we would rather use and depend on volunteer provided and managed
> services - even if that means we cannot just use our checkbook to make
> them do what we want them to do".
> Again - this comment is not meant to criticize what has been done, it is
> meant to raise problem awareness for the future.

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