[Osmf-talk] AoA changes in Dec?

[Simon Poole]

Am 11.10.2020 um 17:01 schrieb Allan Mustard:
>
> Simon, et al,
>
> I can answer a couple of the questions and will leave the others for 
> other Board members to respond to.
>
>> Isn't that just a very roundabout way of saying that you want to 
>> rename working group to committees and potentially give them some 
>> more legal standing (in general for all 4 suggestions you didn't 
>> indicate -why- you would want to propose the change, leaving it to 
>> speculation). 
> No.  The Working Groups would continue to do OSM business, i.e., deal 
> with data, license, software, hardware, SOTM, etc, aka the "fun" 
> stuff.  The committees would do OSMF (Foundation) business, which is 
> administrative, such as the budget, such as strategic planning (which 
> BTW is a legal requirement under the Companies Act 2006), etc.  Less 
> fun but necessary.  Right now, the AoA specifies that committees may 
> consist only of Board members, and we're finding that we Board members 
> could use a little help from the community. 

Isn't that actually a "yes" then?

The only active working group that is not engaging solely in OSMF 
business is the DWG, making the other ones "committees" would remove 
some uncertainty in how far they actually speak for and can commit the 
foundation. Not to mention that is might go a bit of the way to address 
the uneasiness the current board has with delegation.

>> Again, while I think I can make a well educated guess at what you 
>> intend by making such a change, it would be better to spell it out. 
>> That said, it is completely unclear to me how you would want to 
>> differentiate between a member voting out of their own free will in a 
>> certain way and doing the same on orders of their employer. 
>> Essentially this would boil down to requiring members to refrain from 
>> voting on issues their employers have asked them to vote in a 
>> specific way, disenfranchising them of their voting rights. 
> It's called takeover protection, with a particular eye on any 
> attempted hostile takeover.  OSM community includes a lot of very 
> intelligent people, including some with good statistical backgrounds, 
> who can certainly draw statistical inferences if a high percentage of 
> employees of company X is correlated with a number of votes for a 
> particular resolution or candidate.  The essence is as you describe, 
> but the point is not to disenfranchise, per se, but rather to dissuade 
> employers from seeking to influence how the community votes in an 
> organized manner.   This would not, incidentally, require an amendment 
> to the AoA, but rather adoption of a policy by the OSMF membership. 
> The Board already has the authority under the AoA to expel members.  
> If you have better ideas for takeover protection, now would be a good 
> time to propose them. 

I would prefer other poison pills (mainly an asset lock on the OSMFs IP) 
as they make it unattractive to try a takeover in the first place, 
instead of measures that potentially lead to long battles in court after 
the fact. They just aren't practical as long as the corporate structure 
and whereabouts of the OSMF are not set in stone.

More generally I'm not convinced that there is really a solution to the 
boards concerns at all, given that employer - employee relationships are 
just one of many ways we can have external entities trying to influence 
the OSMF to further their interests.

Simon

> cheers,
> apm
>
> On 10/11/2020 10:15 AM, Simon Poole wrote:
>>
>> Am 11.10.2020 um 15:53 schrieb Rory McCann (OSMF Board):
>>>
>>>  * that any OSMF member, not just board members, may serve on 
>>> committees;
>>
>> Isn't that just a very roundabout way of saying that you want to 
>> rename working group to committees and potentially give them some 
>> more legal standing (in general for all 4 suggestions you didn't 
>> indicate -why- you would want to propose the change, leaving it to 
>> speculation).
>>
>>>  * that people who get free membership via the Active Contribution 
>>> Membership system get regular membership, not just the current 
>>> associate membership;
>>
>> Doesn't that run afoul of the guarantee regular members have to 
>> commit to?
>>
>>>  * that if you vote in accordance with orders from your employer or 
>>> other authority,  you aren't a member any more and your vote doesn't 
>>> count;
>>
>> Again, while I think I can make a well educated guess at what you 
>> intend by making such a change, it would be better to spell it out. 
>> That said, it is completely unclear to me how you would want to 
>> differentiate between a member voting out of their own free will in a 
>> certain way and doing the same on orders of their employer. 
>> Essentially this would boil down to requiring members to refrain from 
>> voting on issues their employers have asked them to vote in a 
>> specific way, disenfranchising them of their voting rights.
>>
>>>  * and whether there should be a third, non-voting class of 
>>> membership, called "supporting member".
>>
>> Again "why?".
>>
>>>
>>> We are not 100% sure exactly how many we will propose, and exactly 
>>> what the wording will be. We will draft and redraft and think and 
>>> consult. Please provide feedback, praise, curses, prayers, and 
>>> hexes. If/when we have more concrete wording, we will, naturally, 
>>> post more.
>>>
>>> On the general topic of AoA changesm are there any AoA changes you 
>>> would like? I am calling for an open discussion. 🙂
>>
>> Term limits that are actually term limits?
>>
>> We've already voted to not have those, so I wouldn't press you on this.
>>
>> Simon
>>
>>
>>>
>>> OSM is an open project, we should work in the open. So I am emailing 
>>> yous.
>>>
>>> As always, if you would like to publish something anonymously, the 
>>> board can consider that. Please email board at osmfoundation.org 
>>> (either using your email address, or you could try something like 
>>> http://anonymouse.org/anonemail.html but we haven't confirmed yet 
>>> that that works). As always, if you would like to contact the board 
>>> privately, email board at osmfoundation.org. As always, this is a 
>>> public message, please feel free to inform other OSM(F) people, 
>>> especially if you think they may not have seen it.
>>>
>>> Rory
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> osmf-talk mailing list
>>> osmf-talk at openstreetmap.org
>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/osmf-talk
>>
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