[Tagging] tagging very wide steps - highway=steps on an area?

Warin 61sundowner at gmail.com
Sat Feb 28 04:44:16 UTC 2015

On 28/02/2015 2:53 PM, John Willis wrote:
> On Feb 27, 2015, at 8:09 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer 
> <dieterdreist at gmail.com <mailto:dieterdreist at gmail.com>> wrote:
>> 2015-02-27 9:07 GMT+01:00 johnw <johnw at mac.com <mailto:johnw at mac.com>>:
>>      I read the wiki entry on steps
>>     (http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:highway%3Dsteps
>>     <http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:highway=steps>) and the
>>     discussion page,
>>     and besides the discussion on which direction means uphill (that
>>     really needs to be decided),
>> I had assumed for years that the direction pointing upwards was a 
>> commonly agreed on standard, being myself an architect I hadn't 
>> expected this to be questionable, but as I got so much flak from 
>> people insisting on the other way round, I now am adding the tag 
>> incline=up to all steps. This way you remove any ambiguity and 
>> introduce some further stability also for cases where the way 
>> direction gets inverted. No need for any (IMHO unachievable) decision 
>> any more ;-)
> We need to have this standardized - just  like waterways and walls - 
> ascent or descent should be implicit in path direction.
> There should be a standardized.
> If that is impossible, then at least the ascent/descent tags should be 
> standardized-
> Ascent=yes / reverse or -1 or however the one way tag works, or the 
> direction=ascent /descent or incline or something - just anything 
> that's standardized.

The thing that attracted my attention to this was the direction of the 
way not being used the same way as standard practice .. and as 
documented in the international and national standards.

Within OSM .. I've checked 
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:incline - that sets a 'standard' 
for the incline direction.

I'm tempted to simply add the information to the wiki for steps. The 
past discussion on this topic  is from years ago. I'll think about it.
>>     can I use steps to define an area, just like highway=pedestrian?
>> There is the area relation proposal which deals explicitly with this 
>> (type=area), but it isn't supported by any data consumer AFAIK.
>> Please note that you have to create a new relation for every 
>> continuous part of stairs (i.e. the stair landings are not included).
>> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Relations/Proposed/Area#Area-steps.2C_steps_which_are_wide_and.2For_irregular

Humm slack. That is a Draft proposal from December 2009 ... I'll contact 
the proposer! Try to advance teh steps bit as I understand that need.

>> Might sound complicated but it is actually quite easy to model:
>> 1. create an empty relation and add the tags:
>> type=area
>> highway=steps
>> (and more like step_count, surface, etc.)
>> 2. draw the upper delimiting way of the steps (border where the last 
>> riser is) and add it with the role "upper" to the relation
>> 3. draw the lower delimiting way (border where the first riser is) 
>> and add it with the role "lower" to the relation
>> done.
>> if you want you can
>> 4. draw the lateral boundaries and add them with the role "lateral" 
>> to the relation (suggested for non-linear lateral boundaries only).
> Is that something I can do in iD? I'll have to read up about 
> relations. I've only ever edited a couple, and that didn't exactly go 
> well.
> Javbw
>> cheers,
>> Martin
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