[Tagging] Postindustrial Castle

Warin 61sundowner at gmail.com
Fri Oct 16 10:12:22 UTC 2015


On 16/10/2015 7:49 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
>
> 2015-10-16 10:02 GMT+02:00 John Willis <johnw at mac.com 
> <mailto:johnw at mac.com>>:
>
>     It just feels weird to tag a more modern structure never used as a
>     castle as a castle.
>
>     You are right - the duck test tells me it is an imposing historic
>     building. And yea, it looks a bit like a castle and is named
>     "castle" - like the disney castle - but it's style is to mimic a
>     castle - it was never meant to really be one. It is a rich
>     person's house.
>
>
>
> You are reading "castle" as a defensive structure, aren't structures 
> like these castles as well:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palace_of_Versailles (ok, that's a 
> palace in English, but a ch√Ęteau in French and a Schloss in German) 
> and according to the historic=castle page in the wiki, these should be 
> tagged with castle_type=palace (or manor or stately when smaller / for 
> lesser nobles)

The OSM wiki page historic=castle has not been 'approved'. I regard it 
as wrong ... in particular with regard to Palaces, Manors .. those are 
buildings ..
Palace is mentioned in the original proposal page for building...

The dividing line between a castle and a building ..
like the difference between a memorial and a monument .. all relative.

A structure that has an outer defensive wall with an inner building that 
also has defensive capabilities is a castle.

A building without defensive capabilities is not a castle.

To me Schloss Ludwigslust 
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schloss_Ludwigslust>, Germany is not a 
castle. It is a building.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludwigslust_Palace


>
> And btw., you have not yet answered the question regarding the 
> Neuschwanstein case. I could name a similar example (besides the other 
> Ludwig II castles in Bavaria), much smaller, here: 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lichtenstein_Castle_%28W%C3%BCrttemberg%29
Appears to be a castle.
> Or also this one, residence of the emperor of Germany (prussian 
> enclave), but not actually a defensive structure (but "fake 
> defensive"): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hohenzollern_Castle

Appears to be a castle. OSM maps 'what is on the ground.. so castle?
>
> Do you agree these are castles? This is the wiki list about castles: 
> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:castle_type
>
> These 19th century castles are all (or mostly) considered castles by 
> the Germans (actually they are either "Burg", or "Schloss", 
> Lichtenstein and Hohenzollern both are "Burg", the same word as for 
> the medieval defensive castles), but they are clearly very different 
> from medieval castles and never have worked as defensive structures 
> (neither have they been intended to be such). Here's a very small 
> example of an actual medieval castle:
> http://www.hohen-hundersingen.de/
> https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burg_Hohenhundersingen

Yep all castles. Ruins.. but were castles.

>  I brought this significance thing up, because that seems to be the 
> distinctive criterion for the three castle types "palace", "manor" and 
> "stately".

To me, "palace", "manor" and "stately" are buildings.. not castles.
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