[Tagging] When was the deprecation of location=kiosk for power=substation discussed?

[Peter Elderson]

Looks like it's australian, to call a power substation a power kiosk. It
converts the high voltage to low voltage and distributes power to
households. Just 'kiosk' is confusing to me.
Dutch: kiosk=small selling booth for small articles e.g. newspapers,
sweets, drinks. Mainly found on railway stations.

2018-04-26 11:56 GMT+02:00 John Sturdy <jcg.sturdy at gmail.com>:

> To me, as a native British-English speaker, "kiosk" doesn't seem to be the
> right word for these.  A kiosk is normally something that *is* large enough
> for a person to enter (typically, someone selling something through a
> hatch).
>
> __John
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 25, 2018 at 8:53 PM, José G Moya Y. <josemoya at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> It was François Lacombe on this list 9n Jan 2, 2018.
>> El mié., 3 de enero de 2018 0:14, François Lacombe <
>> fl.infosreseaux at gmail.com> escribió:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Regarding this location=kiosk topic, a discussion was opened on talk page
>> of power=substation key.
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Tag:power%3Dsubstat
>> ion#Kiosk_substations_in_street_cabinets
>>
>> Since no big issue has been raised, I've updated mentionned wiki pages
>> (with French version when available) with man_made=street_cabinet.
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dtransformer#
>> Location_values
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:location
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:substation%3Dminor_distribution
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dsubstation#Location
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dstreet_cabinet
>>
>> location=kiosk is not a recommended value anymore and it's encouraged to
>> replace it manually and carefully with man_made=street_cabinet +
>> street_cabinet=power
>>
>> location key can now be used everytime to give the right
>> substation/transformer's location, in cabinet or not.
>> We can have underground or indoor cabinets like this :
>> man_made=street_cabinet
>> street_cabinet=power
>> power=substation
>> substation=minor_distribution
>> location=underground or indoor or ...
>>
>> All the best
>>
>> François
>>
>> 2017-11-04 11:45 GMT+01:00 François Lacombe <fl.infosreseaux at gmail.com>:
>>
>> Hi
>>
>> The man_made=street_cabinet key sounds suitable to map items described
>> with power=substation + location=kiosk.
>> They are actual small cabinets like those where no technician can enter
>> to work (opposite of building) : https://wiki.openstreetmap.o
>> rg/wiki/File:10kV_trafo_kiosk.jpg
>>
>> Street cabinet is the container while substation is the function.
>>
>> Wiki example on this page gives follwing tags:
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dsubstation#Examples
>> power=substation
>> substation=minor_distribution
>> location=kiosk
>>
>> I propose to update it as such :
>> man_made=street_cabinet
>> street_cabinet=power
>> power=substation
>> substation=minor_distribution
>> location=pavement (or wherever the cabinet is located)
>>
>> It works both for nodes or areas.
>> Additionnal advantage is to get location=* back to give cabinet position
>> instead of substation design (there was issues to tag underground kiosks
>> for instance)
>> There are 7k objects in db:
>> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/location=kiosk
>>
>> Pages to update are :
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dtransformer#
>> Location_values
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:location
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:substation%3Dminor_distribution
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dsubstation#Location
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dstreet_cabinet
>>
>> How do you feel about it ?
>>
>> There are no need of a time consuming formal proposal to deal with this
>> question.
>> Without further coments, i will update wiki pages in 15 days.
>> No automated edits.
>>
>> Thanks for your time
>>
>> François
>>
>>
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>>
>> El mié., 25 de abril de 2018 21:32, Michael Reichert <
>> osm-ml at michreichert.de> escribió:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> while adding a substation to OSM yesterday I looked up the possible
>>> values of location=* and missed kiosk. A short glance in the history
>>> showes that it removed location=kiosk from the page on 2018-01-02. The
>>> edit description mentions man_made=street_cabinet+street_cabinet=power
>>> as a replacement.
>>>
>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:power%
>>> 3Dsubstation&oldid=1542685
>>>
>>> location=kiosk was introduced by the approved Substation Refinement
>>> Proposal in 2013.
>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Substa
>>> tion_refinement#Substation
>>>
>>> man_made=street_cabinet was introduced by the Street Cabinet Proposal in
>>> 2014.
>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Street_cabinet
>>> This proposal does not mention substations or transformers at all.
>>>
>>> I think that small substations are not street cabinets because they are
>>> much larger than street cabinets and are usually not located on the
>>> sidewalk but next to it on a separate area.
>>>
>>> I don't remember a discussion of this change, do you? If no, I propose
>>> to revert this change on the wiki.
>>>
>>> Best regards
>>>
>>> Michael
>>>
>>>
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-- 
Vr gr Peter Elderson
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