[Tagging] When was the deprecation of location=kiosk for power=substation discussed?

Thu Apr 26 10:33:53 UTC 2018

Australians also know a kiosk as a small selling booth for small articles e.g. newspapers, sweets, drinks often found on central city railway stations.

N

> On 26 Apr 2018, at 8:22 pm, James <james2432 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> @Peter, Same here in Canada. No one calls a substation a kiosk here
> 
>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2018, 6:16 AM Peter Elderson, <pelderson at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Looks like it's australian, to call a power substation a power kiosk. It converts the high voltage to low voltage and distributes power to households. Just 'kiosk' is confusing to me. 
>> Dutch: kiosk=small selling booth for small articles e.g. newspapers, sweets, drinks. Mainly found on railway stations.
>> 
>> 2018-04-26 11:56 GMT+02:00 John Sturdy <jcg.sturdy at gmail.com>:
>>> To me, as a native British-English speaker, "kiosk" doesn't seem to be the right word for these.  A kiosk is normally something that *is* large enough for a person to enter (typically, someone selling something through a hatch).
>>> 
>>> __John
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Wed, Apr 25, 2018 at 8:53 PM, José G Moya Y. <josemoya at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> It was François Lacombe on this list 9n Jan 2, 2018.
>>>> El mié., 3 de enero de 2018 0:14, François Lacombe <fl.infosreseaux at gmail.com> escribió:
>>>> Hi,
>>>> 
>>>> Regarding this location=kiosk topic, a discussion was opened on talk page of power=substation key.
>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Tag:power%3Dsubstation#Kiosk_substations_in_street_cabinets
>>>> 
>>>> Since no big issue has been raised, I've updated mentionned wiki pages (with French version when available) with man_made=street_cabinet.
>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dtransformer#Location_values
>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:location
>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:substation%3Dminor_distribution
>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dsubstation#Location
>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dstreet_cabinet
>>>> 
>>>> location=kiosk is not a recommended value anymore and it's encouraged to replace it manually and carefully with man_made=street_cabinet + street_cabinet=power
>>>> 
>>>> location key can now be used everytime to give the right substation/transformer's location, in cabinet or not.
>>>> We can have underground or indoor cabinets like this : 
>>>> man_made=street_cabinet
>>>> street_cabinet=power
>>>> power=substation
>>>> substation=minor_distribution
>>>> location=underground or indoor or ...
>>>> 
>>>> All the best
>>>> 
>>>> François
>>>> 
>>>> 2017-11-04 11:45 GMT+01:00 François Lacombe <fl.infosreseaux at gmail.com>:
>>>> Hi
>>>> 
>>>> The man_made=street_cabinet key sounds suitable to map items described with power=substation + location=kiosk.
>>>> They are actual small cabinets like those where no technician can enter to work (opposite of building) : https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:10kV_trafo_kiosk.jpg
>>>> 
>>>> Street cabinet is the container while substation is the function. 
>>>> 
>>>> Wiki example on this page gives follwing tags:
>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dsubstation#Examples
>>>> power=substation
>>>> substation=minor_distribution 
>>>> location=kiosk
>>>> 
>>>> I propose to update it as such :
>>>> man_made=street_cabinet
>>>> street_cabinet=power
>>>> power=substation
>>>> substation=minor_distribution
>>>> location=pavement (or wherever the cabinet is located)
>>>> 
>>>> It works both for nodes or areas.
>>>> Additionnal advantage is to get location=* back to give cabinet position instead of substation design (there was issues to tag underground kiosks for instance) 
>>>> There are 7k objects in db:
>>>> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/location=kiosk
>>>> 
>>>> Pages to update are :
>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dtransformer#Location_values
>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:location
>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:substation%3Dminor_distribution
>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dsubstation#Location
>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dstreet_cabinet
>>>> 
>>>> How do you feel about it ?
>>>> 
>>>> There are no need of a time consuming formal proposal to deal with this question.
>>>> Without further coments, i will update wiki pages in 15 days.
>>>> No automated edits.
>>>> 
>>>> Thanks for your time
>>>> 
>>>> François
>>>> 
>>>> 
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>>>> El mié., 25 de abril de 2018 21:32, Michael Reichert <osm-ml at michreichert.de> escribió:
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>> 
>>>>> while adding a substation to OSM yesterday I looked up the possible
>>>>> values of location=* and missed kiosk. A short glance in the history
>>>>> showes that it removed location=kiosk from the page on 2018-01-02. The
>>>>> edit description mentions man_made=street_cabinet+street_cabinet=power
>>>>> as a replacement.
>>>>> 
>>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:power%3Dsubstation&oldid=1542685
>>>>> 
>>>>> location=kiosk was introduced by the approved Substation Refinement
>>>>> Proposal in 2013.
>>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Substation_refinement#Substation
>>>>> 
>>>>> man_made=street_cabinet was introduced by the Street Cabinet Proposal in
>>>>> 2014.
>>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Street_cabinet
>>>>> This proposal does not mention substations or transformers at all.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I think that small substations are not street cabinets because they are
>>>>> much larger than street cabinets and are usually not located on the
>>>>> sidewalk but next to it on a separate area.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I don't remember a discussion of this change, do you? If no, I propose
>>>>> to revert this change on the wiki.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Best regards
>>>>> 
>>>>> Michael
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> -- 
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>>>>> ausgenommen)
>>>>> I prefer GPG encryption of emails. (does not apply on mailing lists)
>>>>> 
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>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Vr gr Peter Elderson
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