[Tagging] Updating definition and description of place=square

[Volker Schmidt]

The place=square tag is difficult to define.

   - It is an area that has often a name, but I know of areas that are
   clearly a square, but have no name (this unnamed square in Padua. If you
   refer to this space you would say the "square behind the supermarket", the
   street addresses of the buildings facing the square are of the nearby
   street)
   - They are often building free spaces surrounded by buildings, but often
   there are even massive buildings on them (Piazza Salvemini
   <https://www.google.it/maps/@45.4145533,11.8829414,3a,75y,114.28h,95.49t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s0Tx4tM7-Vcmbjbo7wV-_dw!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo3.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3D0Tx4tM7-Vcmbjbo7wV-_dw%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D151.5563%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656?hl=it>
   in Padua; Place Charles de Gaulle, Paris
   <https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/xGtKBUpd5FMf3lEbq3UbCg>; Piazza del
   Colosseo <https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/YMpq0NsQuXBRfyyTlVMzNA>, Rome)
   - It often has streets, or mainly has streets (Place d’Italie, Paris
   <https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/Tn3L7OVaKkf4jmIatTyh9A>)
   - It often has or is a car park (Piazzale Boschetti, Padova - I have
   seen it used as central bus station and then as car park
   <https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/X0hvpZVn_is-VSGshSJWxA>)
   - It may be (partially) pedestrian


Basically what I want to arrive at is: a square is usually a well defined
contiguous area in a city, which most often has a common name that refers
to the origin as a public space. But it has no default use in OSM. The uses
need to be added.

Volker



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On Sun, 22 Mar 2020 at 15:13, Paul Allen <pla16021 at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Sun, 22 Mar 2020 at 13:23, Tom Pfeifer via Tagging <
> tagging at openstreetmap.org> wrote:
>
>> I fully agree with Martin here. The place=* key is used in OSM to
>> indicate that a particular
>> location is known by a particular name, and that is independent of
>> details of the usage.
>>
>
> Ummmmm, the name is everything?  So if it's named "Foo square" it's a
> place=square
> even if it's not a place for people to congregate and it's not square?
> Take a look
> at Finch's Square (aka Finch Square):
>
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/?mlat=52.08304&mlon=-4.65750#map=19/52.08304/-4.65750
> It's not square.  As rendered there appears to be more pedestrian space
> than there
> really is, it's basically roads with standard-size sidewalks. It's not a
> place for
> people to congregate and (possibly) have public functions, it's
> effectively the town
> bus station, as can be seen here: https://goo.gl/maps/UjG2pbgG1kRSBu1bA
> I wouldn't use place=square on it, even though the name is "Finch's
> Square."
>
>>
>> However OSM is more than rendering, it is about analysing the data. And
>> when I ask e.g. Nominatim
>> or Overpass where all the Squares in my town are, I wish them to be
>> included by the place=square tag
>> and not lose some where the place tag has been omitted just because they
>> are filled with a park.
>>
>
> So how does a mapper know when to use place=square?  Because the geometry
> is square?  They're not all perfect squares.  Because it has "Square" in
> its name?
> You can do a wildcard search in overpass for that, you don't need a
> place=square (but you'll also get the bus station above).  Or are we
> talking about
> a place where the public congregate? In which case we don't need
> place=square
> for a park (even if its shape is square) but we do need it for a paved
> pedestrian area
> that is effectively a public square, whatever the shape and whatever the
> name.
>
> --
> Paul
>
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