[Tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting - Pumping proposal

Joseph Eisenberg joseph.eisenberg at gmail.com
Sat Nov 21 05:19:34 UTC 2020

On the Talk page, the proposal author has now ignored two different
requests to change the new pump=values to a different key like
pump_mechanism, which would allow the continued use of pump=manual and

The author claims: "I find current tagging meaningless (with all due
respect to people who created it in the past)"

This is absolutely disrespectful to the current mappers using this tag to
specify the type of water well found in lower-income countries.

Perhaps you have never lived in a place where people get their drinking and
washing water from public or semi-public wells. In these places it is quite
important to know if a well is just a hole in the ground where you need to
use a bucket and rope to draw out water (pump=no), or if there is a
mechanical pump handle which you can physically operate, with some amount
of force, to pump out bursts of water (pump=manual).

And the other type of well is "a well that is attached to pipes and a
motorized pump", which is usually powered by electricity but sometimes by a
diesel motor. In this type of well you don't have to use any physical
effort at all, you just flip a switch or open a faucet and water comes out
- as most Westerners are accustomed to enjoy in their own homes.

But you will need electricity or fuel to operate it. So usually a
man_made=water_well + pump=powered is much more convenient, but when the
power goes out or there is no fuel, it can be nearly useless, while a
pump=manual is now much more helpful.

I am quite frustrated that this proposal has gone forward even though these
concerns were brought up months ago on the Talk page.

-- Joseph Eisenberg

On Fri, Nov 20, 2020 at 4:23 AM François Lacombe <fl.infosreseaux at gmail.com>

> Dear Mateusz,
> Proposal goes through different stages and I was proposing simpler
> driver=* instead of mechanical_driver. Comments have been made about the
> possible confusion with human drivers driving cars.
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Proposed_features/Pumping_proposal#Consider_drivers_as_pump_specific_devices
> However, drivers aren't specific to pumps at all.
> Current pump=* doesn't deal with pumps but with water wells and possible
> motors/engines installed to get water. I was confused by this in the very
> beginning.
> pump=powered mixes electric motors and gasoline engines which are way
> different. Situations may occur with emergency services coming with
> gasoline to run an electric motor for instance.
> The opportunity (not an obligation) to replace this particular value with
> more detailed and useful information is the goal of the proposal.
> One possible way to state the isn't manually operable is to use handle=no
> without any mechanical_driver (waiting to be defined by knowledgeable
> people)
> All the best
> François
> Le ven. 20 nov. 2020 à 12:22, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging <
> tagging at openstreetmap.org> a écrit :
>> I am not a fan of deprecating
>> pump=manual and replacing it with nearly impossible to remember and less
>> clear
>> mechanical_driver=manual
>> Also, this proposal deprecates pump=powered without providing replacement
>> Now to tag this info one is supposed to select value from
>> reciprocating_solenoid
>> combustion_engine
>> electric_motor
>> cylinder
>> turbine
>> and no way to tag equivalent of pump=powered is provided.
>> Mapper may be uninterested in or unable to get info about technical
>> detail,
>> but they should be still able to tag info that pump is not manually
>> operated.
>> Nov 19, 2020, 20:05 by fl.infosreseaux at gmail.com:
>> Hi all
>> Tonight I'm pleased to announce the start of voting for the tagging
>> proposal about pumps
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Pumping_proposal
>> A lot of comments lead us to an interesting tagging for pumps devices,
>> water wells and wind pumps. Thank you to anyone involved in this review.
>> Some values are proposed to be deprecated as to classify pumps according
>> to their technologies and capabilities.
>> Several contributors tested the proposed tags in real conditions and no
>> problem seems to remain.
>> Feel free to give your opinion until December 3
>> All the best
>> François
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