[Tagging] Adjust proposal: cycle_barrier=squeeze to cycle_barrier=tilted

[nathan case]

It was mostly “for info” – so I’m glad you were able to use it to help improve the documentation.

(Note: I particularly enjoy the last image here showing a K-frame: https://www.cyclesheffield.org.uk/2017/01/04/barriers-on-cycle-paths/ which shows how councils in the UK think sometimes…)

I don’t think any of “A-frame” / “K-frame”, “squeeze”, or “tilted” are particularly recognisable based on their value alone. For me, it’s the example image that clearly identifies this type of barrier.

I suppose one benefit to “tilted” is that it can be used to encompass both “a-frame” and “k-frame” barriers. Whilst the benefit to A-frame (or K-frame) is that it is the (UK’s) industry used name – so we’re not just inventing our own value.

From: Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging <tagging at openstreetmap.org>
Sent: 19 October 2021 07:23
To: Tag discussion, strategy and related tools <tagging at openstreetmap.org>
Cc: Mateusz Konieczny <matkoniecz at tutanota.com>
Subject: Re: [Tagging] Adjust proposal: cycle_barrier=squeeze to cycle_barrier=tilted

Do you think that cycle_barrier=a_frame or cycle_barrier=a-frame
would be clearly better than cycle_barrier=tilted?

(I have no idea how recognizable this name would be)

Note that its variant is called K-barrier:
https://www.cycling-embassy.org.uk/dictionary/access-barrier
http://www.kbarriers.co.uk/barrier-type/

Or are you mentioning to help improve documentation?
(thanks for that! I added it to
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:cycle_barrier&diff=2210088&oldid=2209729
)

Oct 19, 2021, 00:13 by nathancase at outlook.com<mailto:nathancase at outlook.com>:
I believe the "official" name for these (at least in the UK) is an "A-frame" barrier. The name deriving from the resemblance to the capital case letter A.

E.g. http://www.kbarriers.co.uk/a-frame-barrier/

I think they're actually designed to prevent motor cycle access and their use is now discouraged on cycle routes e.g.,
https://www.cycling-embassy.org.uk/dictionary/access-barrier

(more problematically, they can also present an access problem for wheelchair users which is worse than for cyclists who can normally just dismount).

Perhaps cycle_barrier=a_frame would be better? But then again, it seems it is often not technically a cycle barrier, it's a motor cycle barrier...


________________________________

From: Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging <tagging at openstreetmap.org<mailto:tagging at openstreetmap.org>>
Sent: Monday, 18 October 2021, 20:26
To: Tag discussion, strategy and related tools
Cc: Mateusz Konieczny
Subject: [Tagging] Adjust proposal: cycle_barrier=squeeze to cycle_barrier=tilted

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:cycle_barrier proposal was recently approved

One of tagged features is barrier like https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Barrier2.jpg
tagged as cycle_barrier=single

Another is following type of barrier, popular in UK:
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Cycle_barrier_squeeze_image.jpg

Proposal had cycle_barrier=squeeze for it.

Unfortunately it appears to be a poor tag name and likely confusing.
- cycle_barrier=squeeze may be wider than narrow cycle_barrier=single
- very narrow cycle_barrier=single requiring squeezing is supposed to be
still tagged cycle_barrier=single
- defining feature of cycle_barrier=squeeze is that it is tilted, becoming
narrower as height increases

Overall this tag name appears to be confusing, with
cycle_barrier=tilted as seemingly better tag name.

So far it was used 48 times, so it is feasible to change this
without bad side effects unlike with some poorly designed
established tagging

It was discussed in
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Proposed_features/Advanced_cycle_barrier_tagging#single_vs_squeeze

proposal author commented:
"Maybe just start a discussion on the Tagging Mailing List and if
there are no vetos, just document the change on the Wiki pages?
We also could check if there are some newer uses of "squeeze"
(mapped since this proposal was approved) and inform the mappers
about the change/change the usage there..."

What you think about such patch for this proposal?
Is anyone opposed?

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