[Talk-GB] Historic England - tagging guidelines - can we agree on the English usage

[Edward Bainton]

Thanks for this summary. I agree tidying up the wiki and our practice is a
good idea and thank you for thinking it all through.

I'm hardly a tagging connoisseur but I'll venture one further point:

I thought Robert Whitaker's point about the ref tag being more efficiently
done as the *dataset* name made a great deal of sense (rather than the
dataset *maintainer* name, HE, Cadw, etc, as at present and retained in
your proposals).

I replied to him, accidentally off-list, pointing out that HE actually runs
two lists ("legacy" and current), which is evidence to me that his
suggestion is germane as well as being more practical/efficient.

I see several advantages:
1) ease of parsing, as RW said
2) related, good precedent for other ref systems
3) expandable in the case that the heritage org decides to renumber things
again

The documentation would be hardly more complex, and if we're changing
things up I think Robert's suggestions are low cost for significant gain.

Edward

On Mon, 26 Jul 2021, 11:41 Tony Shield, <tonyosm9 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Having started this discussion may I summarise and then outline what
> actions I propose to perform unless there are objections.
>
> I intend to change the HE entries I have added over the last year or so to
> conform to this agreed scheme on a case by case basis - no mechanical edit.
>
> If people want a mechanical edit I will assist if I can.
>
> Wiki sites
>
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:heritage
>
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:listed_status
>
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:HE_ref
>
> Summary
>
> The preferred operator is of the form
>
> heritage:operator=Historic England
> heritage:operator=Cadw
> heritage:operator=Historic Environment Scotland
> heritage:operator=Northern Ireland Environment Agency
>
> The preferred references are of the form
>
> ref:he=12345
> ref:hs=LB2345
> ref:cadw=34567
> ref:niea=55643
>
> as defined in the Key:heritage.
>
> The country namespaced version  ref:GB:he has merit and I can see has a
> definition for Austria, China, Hong Kong but with lower case country codes;
> I will not change to this format without further discussion.
>
> Proposal
>
> 1. Change the Key:heritage page to use the full name rather than the
> abbreviated names.
>
> 2. Change the Key:listed_status page to remove the HE_ref references, also
> change the operator references to conform with 1 above, list tags which are
> relevant to a complete listing e.g. url of HE, operator of the site,
> start_date of the building.
>
> 3. Modify the Key:HE_ref page to indicate this is deprecated and the style
> of Key:heritage is preferred.
>
> Regards
>
> Tony (TonyS999)
> On 21/07/2021 13:15, Jez Nicholson wrote:
>
> I also think that full name should be used for heritage:operator=Historic
> England
>
> I would like refs to be GB namespaced.... ref:GB:he, ref:GB:hs,
> ref:GB:cadw, ref:GB:niea
>
> On Wed, Jul 21, 2021 at 1:11 PM Mark Goodge <mark at good-stuff.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> On 21/07/2021 11:51, Tony Shield wrote:
>> > -------------------------------------------
>> >
>> > There is clear conflict between heritage:operator with values of
>> > Historic England and he.
>> >
>> > References are using the tags HE_ref or ref:he with the same value.
>> >
>> > Data Integrity suggests using one method of tagging and having the
>> > documentation clear about which tagging to use.
>> >
>> > Can we discuss with a view to agreeing one method - the Global heritage
>> > style or the UK listed status style?
>>
>> My personal opinion, for what it's worth, is that the value of
>> heritage:operator should be the normal English name, not an
>> abbreviation. So
>>
>> heritage:operator=Historic England
>> heritage:operator=Cadw
>> heritage:operator=Historic Environment Scotland
>> heritage:operator=Northern Ireland Environment Agency
>>
>> but the ref tag should follow the global pattern, rather than creating
>> new tags, and use abbreviations. So, for example:
>>
>> ref:he=12345
>> ref:hs=LB2345
>> ref:cadw=34567
>> ref:niea=55643
>>
>> This makes for consistency and better machine reading of the data, while
>> preserving human readability of tag values.
>>
>> Mark
>>
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