[Talk-us] Turn restriction dispute FHP

[Skye Book]

If it wasn't this dispute then it would have been another.  At least now there's a precedent set for ground truth and following the local laws.  One of the premises of OSM is that crowd-sourcing and local knowledge improves the quality of the maps, I think this conversation and eventual legal conclusion attained by going to the local authorities is exactly what OSM is about.

On Feb 11, 2013, at 12:22 PM, Clay Smalley <claysmalley at gmail.com> wrote:

> I think it's a little ridiculous that this dispute is going so far that anyone even consulted an expert. Obviously NE2 is wrong; we get it. This dead horse hasn't just been beaten; it's been liquefied. Let's just let the OSM gods deal with it, and go on with our lives.
> 
> On Feb 11, 2013 10:35 AM, "Michael Patrick" <geodesy99 at gmail.com> wrote:
> FYI, an official ruling from Mouseland. This email stuff is pretty cool, one can actually directly ask somebody who is a Subject Matter Expert! ;-)
> 
> Michael
> 
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: FHP <FHP at flhsmv.gov>
> Date: Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 8:08 AM
> Subject: RE: Legal Intersection Crossing
> To: Michael Patrick <geodesy99 at gmail.com>
> 
> 
> Dear Michael,
> 
>  
> 
> Thanks for your inquiry. Your question is:
> 
>  
> 
> The maneuver in question is whether one can proceed from the off ramp stop line, proceed perpendicular across Buena Vista Dr. , and enter onto the southbound onramp back onto southbound World Drive.  
> 
>  
> 
> The answer is “not without violating Florida law”.
> 
>  
> 
> Point #1: The off ramp lane in your scenario is clearly marked as a “Left Turn Only” lane by the turn arrows painted on the roadway. In your scenario, instead of making a legal left turn, you would drive straight across the intersection and cross a “solid white line” and enter a “Right turn only lane” as indicated by the right turn arrows painted on the roadway.
> 
>  
> 
> Point #2: The right turn lane on Buena Vista Dr in which you would be entering, has a solid white line on both sides of the lane which means that a vehicle that has lawfully entered the lane cannot exit or change lanes and no other vehicles are permitted to cross the solid white line to enter the lane at that location.
> 
>  
> 
> The Florida Driver Handbook states on page 47:
> 
>  
> 
> Solid White Line
> 
> A solid white line marks the right edge of the roadway or separates lanes of traffic moving in the
> 
> same direction. You may travel in the same direction on both sides of this line, but you should
> 
> not cross the line unless you must do so to avoid a hazard.
> 
>  
> 
> Since no hazard exit, this would be a violation of Florida Law.
> 
>  
> 
> Customer Service Center
> 
> Correspondence/Email Unit
> 
> Department of Highway Safety and Motor Vehicles
> 
> www.flhsmv.gov
> 
>  
> 
>  
> The Department of Highway Safety and Motor Vehicles is committed to Service, Integrity, Courtesy, Professionalism, Innovation and Excellence in all we do. Please let us know how we are doing via our online customer service survey at https://www.research.net/s/MLR9RGC.
> 
> 
> 
> From: Michael Patrick [mailto:geodesy99 at gmail.com] 
> Sent: Monday, February 11, 2013 1:47 AM
> To: FHP
> Subject: Legal Intersection Crossing
> 
>  
> 
> We are embedding turn restrictions in automated routing software. 
> 
>  
> 
> What is contested: 
> 
>  
> 
> The general area is west of Epcot Center, the end of the southbound off ramp from southbound World Drive to the intersection with Buena Vista Dr.
> 
> See attached photo BuenaVistaDrive-004.jpg ( or 
> 
> https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bxor0dnxUrN2S25sLXRLUW4wb0E/edit?usp=sharing )
> 
>  
> 
> The maneuver in question is whether one can proceed from the off ramp stop line, proceed perpendicular across Buena Vista Dr. , and enter onto the southbound on ramp back onto southbound World Drive.  This is shown as the red arrow on BuenaVistaDrive-001.jpg ( or see 
> 
> https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bxor0dnxUrN2M0lIY0RoUUEzUTA/edit?usp=sharing )
> 
>  
> 
> This seems to be indicated because of the double signal visible from the off ramp stop line, even though at this point the road is a single lane. Also,there is a white left turn pavement arrow on the exit ramp.
> 
> See the red arrow on BuenaVistaDrive-002.jpg ( or 
> 
> https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bxor0dnxUrN2em84TG1jb2hTcTQ/edit?usp=sharing )
> 
>  
> 
> Superficially, at least, it seems possible to do this without crossing the gore markers in the intersection.
> 
> BuenaVistaDrive-003.jpg ( or 
> 
> https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bxor0dnxUrN2X1RKVzI3RXdzQzA/edit?usp=sharing )
> 
>  
> 
> Also, although there is only a double signal on Buena Vista Dr. eastbound at this intersection, the stop line extends all the way across all three lanes of traffic, including the exit only onto the southbound World Drive ramp. 
> 
> BuenaVistaDrive-005.jpg ( or 
> 
> https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bxor0dnxUrN2YlotaTVMRHA2OW8/edit?usp=sharing )
> 
>  
> 
> After researching the Federal Highway Standards, the Florida Driver's Manual, etc. we were unable to make a conclusion. 
> 
>  
> 
> Thank you for your time and consideration,
> 
>  
> 
> Michael Patrick
> 
> Open Street Map
> 
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
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