[OSM-talk] Mapping dangerous bicycle locations?

Volker Schmidt voschix at gmail.com
Sun Mar 8 15:01:06 UTC 2015 

I have just added this comment to the page
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Proposed_features/hazard
Subdivision of the hazard namespace

To me it would come naturally to subdivide the namespace as follows for
different users of the road:

   - hazard:general=


   - hazard:pedestrian=


   - hazard:motor_vehicle=


   - hazard:bicycle=


   - etc.

(This could absorb 1:1 the existing cycle_hazard tagging)

The main reason for such a subdivision is obviously that the hazards for
the different users are different."

On 8 March 2015 at 15:59, Volker Schmidt <voschix at gmail.com> wrote:

> I have just added this comment to the page
>
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Proposed_features/hazard
> Subdivision of the hazard namespace
>
> To me it would come naturally to subdivide the namespace as follows for
> different users of the road:
>
>    - hazard:general=
>
>
>    - hazard:pedestrian=
>
>
>    - hazard:motor_vehicle=
>
>
>    - hazard:bicycle=
>
>
>    - etc.
>
> (This could absorb 1:1 the existing cycle_hazard tagging)
>
> The main reason for such a subdivision is obviously that the hazards for
> the different users are different."
>
>
> On 8 March 2015 at 13:00, <talk-request at openstreetmap.org> wrote:
>
>> Send talk mailing list submissions to
>>         talk at openstreetmap.org
>>
>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>         https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>         talk-request at openstreetmap.org
>>
>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>>         talk-owner at openstreetmap.org
>>
>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> than "Re: Contents of talk digest..."
>>
>>
>> Today's Topics:
>>
>>    1. Re: High load on the rendering servers? (Simon Poole)
>>    2. Re: High load on the rendering servers? (Eugene Alvin Villar)
>>    3. Re: High load on the rendering servers? (Tom Hughes)
>>    4. Re: High load on the rendering servers? (Christoph Hormann)
>>    5. Re: Mapping dangerous bicycle locations? (Martin Koppenhoefer)
>>    6. Re: Mapping dangerous bicycle locations? (Stefan Keller)
>>    7. Re: Mapping dangerous bicycle locations? (Tobias Preuss)
>>    8. Re: Mapping dangerous bicycle locations? (Martin Koppenhoefer)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2015 23:15:47 +0100
>> From: Simon Poole <simon at poole.ch>
>> To: talk at openstreetmap.org
>> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] High load on the rendering servers?
>> Message-ID: <54FB7893.4070605 at poole.ch>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>
>>
>> Jon Burgess tracked the issue down to a way node being dragged from
>> Japan to Brazil on the 3rd of this month, creating a very very long way
>> that increased the rendering time for a large number of tiles at high
>> zoom levels.
>>
>> Simon
>>
>> Am 07.03.2015 um 21:39 schrieb Grant Slater:
>> > Hi Andrew,
>> >
>> > Yes were are aware there is an issue. We haven't yet tracked down the
>> issue.
>> > We have been discussing it in #osm-dev on http://irc.openstreetmap.org
>> today.
>> >
>> > Kind regards,
>> > Grant
>> > Part of the OSM sysadmin
>> >
>> >
>> > On 6 March 2015 at 15:20, Andrew Guertin <andrew.guertin at uvm.edu>
>> wrote:
>> >> For the past few days, lots of things I've changed haven't had their
>> tiles
>> >> re-rendered, and I noticed that the servers are reporting very high
>> load and
>> >> lots of dropped tiles:
>> http://munin.openstreetmap.org/renderd-week.html
>> >>
>> >> Based on my (completely uneducated) reading of the graphs there, it
>> looks
>> >> like something is filling the Priority Request Queue and keeping it
>> full,
>> >> and there's very little time for anything else. (It looks like the
>> Request
>> >> Queue and the Low Priority Request Queue are also being kept full).
>> >>
>> >> Anyone know what's causing this?
>> >>
>> >> --Andrew
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> talk mailing list
>> >> talk at openstreetmap.org
>> >> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > talk mailing list
>> > talk at openstreetmap.org
>> > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>
>>
>> -------------- next part --------------
>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
>> Name: signature.asc
>> Type: application/pgp-signature
>> Size: 473 bytes
>> Desc: OpenPGP digital signature
>> URL: <
>> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20150307/7a03e42f/attachment-0001.sig
>> >
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2015 12:28:14 +0800
>> From: Eugene Alvin Villar <seav80 at gmail.com>
>> To: Simon Poole <simon at poole.ch>
>> Cc: OpenStreetMap <talk at openstreetmap.org>
>> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] High load on the rendering servers?
>> Message-ID:
>>         <
>> CAPhqi6Lp9mSyRVsJLWepLpZ6e3gLxL6bZrK3Pru_F0gMAizhFg at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>
>> On Sun, Mar 8, 2015 at 6:15 AM, Simon Poole <simon at poole.ch> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > Jon Burgess tracked the issue down to a way node being dragged from
>> > Japan to Brazil on the 3rd of this month, creating a very very long way
>> > that increased the rendering time for a large number of tiles at high
>> > zoom levels.
>> >
>>
>> Wow. This constitutes an extremely simple way to mount a DoS attack on the
>> OSM tileservers. I will have to assume that the Operations WG is already
>> thinking of ideas on how to prevent this possibility in the future.
>> -------------- next part --------------
>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>> URL: <
>> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20150308/b853e2b8/attachment-0001.html
>> >
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 3
>> Date: Sun, 08 Mar 2015 08:45:51 +0000
>> From: Tom Hughes <tom at compton.nu>
>> To: Eugene Alvin Villar <seav80 at gmail.com>, Simon Poole
>>         <simon at poole.ch>
>> Cc: OpenStreetMap <talk at openstreetmap.org>
>> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] High load on the rendering servers?
>> Message-ID: <54FC0C3F.5080704 at compton.nu>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
>>
>> On 08/03/15 04:28, Eugene Alvin Villar wrote:
>> > On Sun, Mar 8, 2015 at 6:15 AM, Simon Poole <simon at poole.ch
>> > <mailto:simon at poole.ch>> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >     Jon Burgess tracked the issue down to a way node being dragged from
>> >     Japan to Brazil on the 3rd of this month, creating a very very long
>> way
>> >     that increased the rendering time for a large number of tiles at
>> high
>> >     zoom levels.
>> >
>> >
>> > Wow. This constitutes an extremely simple way to mount a DoS attack on
>> > the OSM tileservers. I will have to assume that the Operations WG is
>> > already thinking of ideas on how to prevent this possibility in the
>> future.
>>
>> I think I can safely say we're not.
>>
>> Of course if you have a brilliant idea how to do such a thing then I'm
>> sure we'd love to hear it.
>>
>> Tom
>>
>> --
>> Tom Hughes (tom at compton.nu)
>> http://compton.nu/
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 4
>> Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2015 10:20:30 +0100
>> From: Christoph Hormann <chris_hormann at gmx.de>
>> To: talk at openstreetmap.org
>> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] High load on the rendering servers?
>> Message-ID: <201503081020.31062.chris_hormann at gmx.de>
>> Content-Type: text/plain;  charset="utf-8"
>>
>> On Sunday 08 March 2015, Tom Hughes wrote:
>> > >
>> > > Wow. This constitutes an extremely simple way to mount a DoS attack
>> > > on the OSM tileservers. I will have to assume that the Operations
>> > > WG is already thinking of ideas on how to prevent this possibility
>> > > in the future.
>> >
>> > I think I can safely say we're not.
>> >
>> > Of course if you have a brilliant idea how to do such a thing then
>> > I'm sure we'd love to hear it.
>>
>> The OSM inspector already has a display mode for ways with long
>> segments - it currently however seems it is not working:
>>
>>
>> http://tools.geofabrik.de/osmi/?view=geometry&overlays=ways_with_long_segments,long_segments
>>
>> And it has a fairly low threshold (0.3 degrees - that is ~40km) so it
>> highlights quite a lot of stuff.  With an additional layer highlighting
>> only the very long segments (like above 300km segment length) you could
>> quickly see such issues.  And editors of course also should prominently
>> warn about such edits.
>>
>> --
>> Christoph Hormann
>> http://www.imagico.de/
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 5
>> Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2015 11:29:34 +0100
>> From: Martin Koppenhoefer <dieterdreist at gmail.com>
>> To: Jochen Topf <jochen at remote.org>
>> Cc: Talk Openstreetmap <talk at openstreetmap.org>
>> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Mapping dangerous bicycle locations?
>> Message-ID: <7770F6F0-C8EF-46CF-BDFA-BDB7231FE451 at gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset=us-ascii
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Am 07.03.2015 um 16:34 schrieb Jochen Topf <jochen at remote.org>:
>>
>> >> See http://wiki.osm.org/wiki/DE:Key:hazard
>> >> And see also https://twitter.com/sfkeller/status/574213951644368896
>> >
>> > Sounds very subjective to me. Doesn't belong in OSM.
>>
>>
>> the German page does indeed define subjective values while there is a
>> proposal which has fairly objective values
>> http://wiki.osm.org/wiki/Proposed_features/hazard
>>
>> cheers
>> Martin
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 6
>> Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2015 11:53:57 +0100
>> From: Stefan Keller <sfkeller at gmail.com>
>> To: Martin Koppenhoefer <dieterdreist at gmail.com>
>> Cc: Talk Openstreetmap <talk at openstreetmap.org>
>> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Mapping dangerous bicycle locations?
>> Message-ID:
>>         <
>> CAFcOn2-dzwUFScYDQa_Ud7RTNtnECFE8i09-J4c+3f4wcSMTkA at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Thanks for the discussion so long. I agree mostly that 1. its
>> potentially subjective and 2. not always visible as "real world"
>> object.
>> I've added a notice to the german page:
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/DE:Key:hazard
>> I actually wonder, if this is a case for WikiProject Cleanup?
>>
>> Yours, S.
>>
>>
>>
>> 2015-03-08 11:29 GMT+01:00 Martin Koppenhoefer <dieterdreist at gmail.com>:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Am 07.03.2015 um 16:34 schrieb Jochen Topf <jochen at remote.org>:
>> >
>> >>> See http://wiki.osm.org/wiki/DE:Key:hazard
>> >>> And see also https://twitter.com/sfkeller/status/574213951644368896
>> >>
>> >> Sounds very subjective to me. Doesn't belong in OSM.
>> >
>> >
>> > the German page does indeed define subjective values while there is a
>> proposal which has fairly objective values
>> http://wiki.osm.org/wiki/Proposed_features/hazard
>> >
>> > cheers
>> > Martin
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 7
>> Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2015 11:56:52 +0100
>> From: Tobias Preuss <tobias.preuss+osm at googlemail.com>
>> To: Martin Koppenhoefer <dieterdreist at gmail.com>
>> Cc: Talk Openstreetmap <talk at openstreetmap.org>
>> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Mapping dangerous bicycle locations?
>> Message-ID:
>>         <CADEaiE-b6+TrXT2k_dCoPL-JuXx3T=
>> OffkzHK3x564AkYnpGKg at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>>
>> This survey might be of interest for (at least the Berlin part of) you.
>> https://radsicherheit.berlin.de
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 8
>> Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2015 12:24:27 +0100
>> From: Martin Koppenhoefer <dieterdreist at gmail.com>
>> To: Stefan Keller <sfkeller at gmail.com>
>> Cc: Talk Openstreetmap <talk at openstreetmap.org>
>> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Mapping dangerous bicycle locations?
>> Message-ID: <067B335C-E160-485A-B232-1BAF5047D69F at gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset=us-ascii
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > Am 08.03.2015 um 11:53 schrieb Stefan Keller <sfkeller at gmail.com>:
>> >
>> > I actually wonder, if this is a case for WikiProject Cleanup?
>>
>>
>> +1, the German page is not a translation of the proposal page, but the
>> latter is much older and dates back to 2007.
>>
>> cheers
>> Martin
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Subject: Digest Footer
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> talk mailing list
>> talk at openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> End of talk Digest, Vol 127, Issue 13
>> *************************************
>>
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20150308/84646bb0/attachment-0001.html>

More information about the talk mailing list