[OSM-talk] An open letter to OSMF board members.

[john whelan]

I've always looked upon the default carto as an introduction to OSM.
Perhaps we need to emphise alternative renders?

Cheerio John

On Wed, Jun 1, 2022, 13:13 Włodzimierz Bartczak <
wlodzimierz.bartczak at openstreetmap.pl> wrote:

> Let me begin by responding to Frederic's voice in this discussion. Mainly
> because I have tremendous respect for his contributions to the project. His
> help was invaluable in removing the vandalism we had problems with in
> Poland.
> Therefore, I think you have not fully understood what is driving me in
> provoking this discussion and the fault lies with me. I will try to express
> myself better and by the way answer collectively.
> 1) I am not interested in whether parcels, forest springs or other POIs
> will be displayed in Carto. The presented problems arose during the project
> of mapping parcel machines in Poland, but feel free to place any other
> object instead of parcel machines. This just illustrates the problem.
> 2) In my opinion, the main problem of Carto is that it doesn't have clear
> goals to fulfill. I agree that sometimes it is overloaded. Unfortunately,
> currently no one is discussing what it should contain, not to mention its
> implementation.
> 3) Nowhere did I say that someone should be paid to develop it.
> 4) The Carto is a collective effort of editors and its creation should be
> a reflection of one of the most democratic communities, OSM. Ask yourselves
> if this is the case.
>
> The discussion I've had and the statements that have emerged make it clear
> that we as a community have a problem here.
>
> Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)
>
> śr., 1 cze 2022 o 01:28 Frederik Ramm <frederik at remote.org> napisał(a):
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I think I've said that in one of those endless diary discussions -
>> almost everyone who complains about something in openstreetmap-carto is
>> just unhappy that they don't get their pet feature rendered.
>>
>> In order to provide acceptable cartography, massive gatekeeping is
>> required on the part of openstreetmap-carto maintainers. For every new
>> feature they accept, they should really throw old two old features,
>> otherwise the map becomes everything else but a map.
>>
>> (We had a map style once where everyone could add their own features in
>> SVN, with nobody doing any gatekeeping. Guess how that turned out.)
>>
>> I'm happy to listen to anyone who has any critique of
>> openstreetmap-carto but NOT TO PEOPLE WHO ARE UNHAPPY BECAUSE THEIR
>> FEATURE DID NOT GET RENDERED.
>>
>> If you are one of those people who are unhappy because their feature did
>> not get rendered, I will assume that any other criticism you have to
>> offer (other than that your feature did not get rendered) is just trying
>> to get revenge.
>>
>> If you're trying to abuse the code-of-conduct system to bully people in
>> the hope of ultimately getting your pet feature rendered, then shame on
>> you - this is not what a code of conduct is for.
>>
>> As for replacing the maintainers - if I understand you correctly you're
>> asking the board to pay people to do the maintenance. I would agree to
>> that if that maintenance is guided by the principle I mentioned above -
>> for every additional feature they accept, throw out two old features.
>>
>> Because if what you're asking is for the board to pay money in order to
>> have more mellow maintainers who will happily accept a 348th crappy icon
>> just so that some niche interest group can have their feature "on the
>> main map" then that would be making OSM worse not better.
>>
>> Bye
>> Frederik
>>
>> --
>> Frederik Ramm  ##  eMail frederik at remote.org  ##  N49°00'09" E008°23'33"
>>
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>>
>
>
> --
>
> Włodzimierz Bartczak
>
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