[OSM-talk] Could I globally replace [building:level] with [building:levels]

Thu May 19 11:52:16 UTC 2022

I have done some local spot checks. Results were clusters of errors by just
two users, both clearly missing "s" type errors. Both users are heavy
contributors. I would propose manual repair, not Maproulette, as the errors
are spatially clustered.
Volker
(Italy)

On Thu, 19 May 2022, 13:08 , <talk-request at openstreetmap.org> wrote:

> Send talk mailing list submissions to
>         talk at openstreetmap.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>         https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>         talk-request at openstreetmap.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>         talk-owner at openstreetmap.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of talk digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: Could I globally replace [building:level] with
>       [building:levels] ? (Dave F)
>    2. Re: Could I globally replace [building:level] with
>       [building:levels] ? (Simon Poole)
>    3. Re: Could I globally replace [building:level] with
>       [building:levels] ? (Andy Townsend)
>    4. Re: Could I globally replace [building:level] with
>       [building:levels] ? (Martin Koppenhoefer)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 18 May 2022 18:38:36 +0100
> From: Dave F <davefoxfac63 at btinternet.com>
> To: talk at openstreetmap.org
> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Could I globally replace [building:level] with
>         [building:levels] ?
> Message-ID: <a517e7b2-55e3-7845-eb69-ddd29eec4c04 at btinternet.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
>
> On 17/05/2022 15:27, Simon Poole wrote:
> >
> > particularly when there is no clear root cause.
>
> If there is a specific reason it's good to sort it, but it doesn't
> invalidate correcting errors.
>
> > Then there is the issue that the data in the tags might not be valid
> > to start with and that has simply been hidden by the invalid key up to
> > now,
>
> If there were errors previously in the value tags, there will still e
> the same number of errors afterwards. Unhiding the key means they're
> more likely to be spotted & corrected
>
>
> > ? for example there are nearly 100 -1 values
>
> There are 636 cases with 'building:levels' so I fail to see your point.
> >
> > only has a very minor impact on data quality
>
> Again, doesn't invalidate error correction.
>
> > and leave things as if,
>
> This is illogical to improving the quality of the OSM database.
> We allow every new users (those most likely to make tagging errors) to
> start amending immediately, which I concur with, yet there's this
> reluctance among some contributors? to allow corrections by amendments
> or deletions.
>
> DaveF
>
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 18 May 2022 23:16:11 +0200
> From: Simon Poole <simon at poole.ch>
> To: Dave F <davefoxfac63 at btinternet.com>, talk at openstreetmap.org
> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Could I globally replace [building:level] with
>         [building:levels] ?
> Message-ID: <461cb0a4-d968-8103-dc35-30d65a4579ef at poole.ch>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"
>
>
> Am 18.05.2022 um 19:38 schrieb Dave F:
> > ....
> > Again, doesn't invalidate error correction.
> >
> >> and leave things as if,
> >
> > This is illogical to improving the quality of the OSM database.
> > We allow every new users (those most likely to make tagging errors) to
> > start amending immediately, which I concur with, yet there's this
> > reluctance among some contributors? to allow corrections by amendments
> > or deletions.
> >
> I didn't suggest that errors shouldn't or couldn't be fixed, just that
> in the absence of a clear root cause (which in an ideal case would
> indicate what the correct fix is), we are likely just replacing errors
> with errors with a mechanical edit, except now we've lost the marker
> that there is actually an issue.
>
> So the best way to improve the data quality is to create a maproulette
> challenge or similar and have the correct values verified.
>
> -------------- next part --------------
> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> Name: OpenPGP_signature
> Type: application/pgp-signature
> Size: 495 bytes
> Desc: OpenPGP digital signature
> URL: <
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20220518/ce3140fa/attachment-0001.sig
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 18 May 2022 23:06:02 +0100
> From: Andy Townsend <ajt1047 at gmail.com>
> To: talk at openstreetmap.org
> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Could I globally replace [building:level] with
>         [building:levels] ?
> Message-ID: <840b3503-2e12-8bbf-3bc1-9c4164d2647e at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"
>
> On 17/05/2022 15:27, Simon Poole wrote:
> >
> > Obviously common sense should be applied, but as you correctly note
> > changing 10k objects globally is touchy, particularly when there is no
> > clear root cause. So as a first step I would try to determine if there
> > is a reason for the mistagging and if yes fix that first, it might be
> > as simple as a typo in a preset.
>
> To get an idea of the source of the problem it's possible to just select
> one value from
>
> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/building%3Alevel#values
>
> and sample the results.? Taking "4" as an example,
>
>   * The originating editor seems to be either iD or JOSM (probably more
>     iD than JOSM, but I presume more buildings are added with iD than JOSM)
>   * The originating date is a fairly wide range.? Some are 10 years old,
>     some recent.
>   * There are more errors where English isn't a first language
>
> There is a "long tail" of silly values (the previously mentioned "-1" on
> page 1, and also others starting on page 2 of
> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/building%3Alevel#values ) that
> need looking at in more detail.
>
> It's pretty clear what
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/2517761586/history is trying to say
> with "building:level" and it's not "this building has -1 levels".
>
> I'm sure that it would be possible to do a sensible mechanical edit here
> that fixed https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/160054444 but left some of
> the others, but it wouldn't just be "change all key X to key Y" worldwide.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Andy
>
>
>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20220518/dcaa38fb/attachment-0001.htm
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Thu, 19 May 2022 09:49:18 +0200
> From: Martin Koppenhoefer <dieterdreist at gmail.com>
> To: Andy Townsend <ajt1047 at gmail.com>
> Cc: talk at openstreetmap.org
> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Could I globally replace [building:level] with
>         [building:levels] ?
> Message-ID:
>         <
> CABPTjTBenJe4A7MvAcu05O45oofnQgeG_7KQqBsGzg9EY4zcKA at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> sent from a phone
>
> On 19 May 2022, at 00:10, Andy Townsend <ajt1047 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> It's pretty clear what
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/2517761586/history
> is trying to say with "building:level" and it's not "this building has -1
> levels".
>
>
>
> with entrance I am using ?level? for these situations, which is quite
> common tagging (69423 instances)
> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/level#combinations
>
> Cheers,
> Martin
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20220519/5479aa69/attachment-0001.htm
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Subject: Digest Footer
>
> _______________________________________________
> talk mailing list
> talk at openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of talk Digest, Vol 213, Issue 15
> *************************************
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20220519/fd25eda8/attachment.htm>