[Osmf-talk] Communication style - moderation - CoC [was Re: Board members with similar background (was: 2018 a third episode...)}

Mikel Maron mikel.maron at gmail.com
Sat Dec 15 21:41:17 UTC 2018

“Culture of violence”? It’s not a culture but steps taken to deal with years of your disruption.
Nicolas, everyone, I’m so tired of this. Communication style, really? Let’s me call your communication style a “Culture of exhaustion”. You personally have exhausted me.
You reference your concerns about conflict of interest? You were simultaneously an employee under the supervision of our executive director and a board member who supervised the ED. You were the boss of your boss!  This a mistake for all of us when we decided on governance structures and roles back in our board F2F in 2011 or 2012. We were young and naive and thought it would all work out because we were friends. As we know that wasn’t enough when money and responsibility and accountability was involved.
I know you were a big and important part of HOT in the beginning. Then it didn’t work out. Big time. Everyone feels bad about it. Can’t we move on? It’s been 5 years.

ps why are you still a HOT Voting Member? You hate the organization, no one is keeping you there.
pps please stop posting here about this. Hasn’t there been enough posts on this? Can’t we spare the 1000 other people on this mailing list another iteration of your 5 year old anger and argument?
On Saturday, December 15, 2018, 4:12 PM, nicolas chavent <nicolas.chavent at gmail.com> wrote:


I do not think that Mikel's email calls for list moderation, nor for
any reflexion/decision/enforcement of any CoC. Self-moderation is way
more effective and more respectful of the sense of responsibility of
each individuals forming the OSM community and the OSMF membership. As
Christoph pointed out, any post on free (non-moderated) mailing-lit of
forum is worth its contents as well as it tells a lot about its
author. Communication style matters in good or in bad and weigh in the
overall reputation of any individual belonging and active in a
collective and in a community.

Mikel's email is illustrative of several difficulties:
- A difficulty to understand that this is during elections times that
members talk and may express disagreements as per the future of their
- A general difficulty to hear and cope with disagreements in a
collective of individuals, this is true in OSMF, this has been equally
true in HOT US Inc;
- A specific difficulty to remain thoughtful and calm during exchanges
with persons with opposite views;
- A difficulty to accept that my position about the presence of HOT US
Inc at the OSMF can be guided by a principle and not by my affects and
a pure anti-HOT US Inc mantra;

This can be a surprise from someone who has been in the past and
currently for many years OSMF Board member and also Board member,
president and chairman of the voting member at HOT US Inc. All those
positions request strong abilities to listen to all parties, foster
dialogue and cool down things without resorting to control or police
mechanisms when collective dynamics got heated by disagreements.

There's a parallel to draw between the communication style of Mikel in
2018 and the one of Dale Kunce (by then President of HOT US Inc) in
the 2017 email thread "[Osmf-talk] HOT US Inc use of Code Of Conduct
(CoC) for Membership control after 2015 OSMF Board election"  [1]

Both emails are a sign of a specific culture of violence within HOT US
Inc, that I described in this 2017 email "[Osmf-talk] About HOT US Inc
"specific" culture at work in Dale Kunce's emails and why it has to be
mitigated at OSMF in 2017 [was Fwd: May 2017 use of Code Of Conduct
(CoC) for Membership control in HOT US Inc internal governance]" [2]

This culture is still at work, I am still under a CoC complaint
process initiated in May 2017 that Mikel, as chairman of the
organization, emailed me and which is still ongoing! I did not hear
back nor from the Board, nor from Mikel and then Joseph Reeves who
took over from Mikel as chairman.

The notification email reads as below:

"---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: Mikel Maron <mikel.maron at hotosm.org>
Date: Sun, May 14, 2017 at 4:15 PM
Subject: Moderation
To: Nicolas Chavent <nicolas.chavent at gmail.com>
Cc: HOT Board <board at hotosm.org>


Code of Conduct complaint procedures have been initiated following
your post to the HOT membership mailing list. You will be hearing
additional information as the process takes the next steps. No actions
or communications are required from you at the moment.

During the process, your messages to the membership mailing list will
be moderated. Messages from you on different topics than the current
complaint, and that meet the standard for good communication, may be
approved. The complaint procedures may take into account any
subsequent communications by you, whether direct, attempted public
posts, or public posts.


Chair of Voting Members"

My post to the HOT US Inc membership mailing list in that matter was
about the history of Conflict Of Interest (CoI) handling in the
organization and a request for the Board to let the members vote (like
in all past cases) to replace a Board Member working for MSF who had
to resign because of MSF CoI policy.

This culture constitutes a specific reason for balancing the presence
of HOT US Inc as an organization at the OSMF Board. It adds to a
position of principle for organizational diversity which apply to any
organization without excluding/preventing any organization (HOT US Inc

Within that culture and this organization, the use of CoC as a
membership control tool, is a case that every OSMF member has to keep
in mind when some express the need of CoC in OSMF and OSM.


[1]: https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/osmf-talk/2017-December/004576.html
[2]: https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/osmf-talk/2017-December/004740.html

On Fri, Dec 14, 2018 at 3:14 PM Mikel Maron <mikel.maron at gmail.com> wrote:
> That’s totally fair Christine. I didn’t have to go that far and say that. Nicolas I apologize.
> I do think we need moderation on this list, and if we did, I would definitely accept whatever the moderator felt relevant (warning, 1 day block from posting, etc)
> Diversity of the Board is a universal concern, mine too. Being involved in HOT is a strong sign of embracing and working for diversity in OSM. Miriam is doing amazing work organizing in Mexico, across Latin America, and with women. Geoffrey has direct experience of mapping in Africa in both easy and very challenging contexts, helped organized SotM Africa, and is bringing together mappers from across the continent. OSM has a lot to learn from them, and if diversity of geography, language and gender in OSM is something you value, they are extremely qualified Board candidates to help us move.
> Mikel
> On Friday, December 14, 2018, 7:35 AM, Christine Karch <christine at hermione.de> wrote:
> Am 14.12.18 um 13:22 schrieb Mikel Maron:
> > I don’t. I think Nicolas is still bitter about being fired. And I think
> As we all see, the need of diversity within the board is a general
> concern of the community. It is not necessary to attack Nicolas personally.
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Nicolas Chavent
Les Libres Géographes
Projet OpenStreetMap (OSM)
Projet Espace OSM Francophone (EOF)
Projet GeOrchestra
Mobile (FR): +33 (0)6 52 40 78 20
Mobile (Haiti): +509 40 19 46 02
Email: nicolas.chavent at gmail.com
Email: nicolas.chavent at leslibresgeographes.org
Skype: c_nicolas
Twitter: nicolas_chavent

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